#685

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Re: #685

Postby Jayleia on Mon May 02, 2011 7:27 pm

Panda S. H. wrote:Jayleia: McCain was also born on a military base while the Panama Canal was operating under US control. His parents--or father, I don't recall--were active duty military at the time. No one questions that on the Republican side. Ever. ((Because of that, lying about service is like... the worst thing possible. I think Bush Jr had some problem with that...)) It's not so much color at this stage in our history--undoubtedly, some are still acting because of it--but because of hie "ties" to the Islamic world.


You're right, I don't think that it's directly color-related, but at the same time, there's still a lot of subtle and not-so-subtle racist parts of our national discourse. People toss about accusations about someone being an "affirmative action baby" for example, while ignoring the fact that the person he was accusing actually graduated Magna Cum Laude from Harvard.

Also his ties to the islamic world, I don't think would be a problem if he looked different. He might be seen as someone experienced in the world, or he might be seen as out of touch with "real americans" but he wouldn't be seen as "One of THEM!", I don't think.
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Re: #685

Postby MadCat on Tue May 03, 2011 5:28 am

You want ties to the Islamic world? How about the fact that the Bush family and the Bin Laden family were long-standing friends for decades, and the Bush government sheltered Bin Laden on various occasions? Notice how the Republicans never talk about that? :mrgreen:

I'd be curious to know what these 'ties to the Islamic world' are in Obama's case. Not because I'm an Obama fan; I'm really not. But I'm genuinely curious; I hadn't heard anything 'Islamic' about him besides his middle name. If anything, he's far too "I'm a Christian and gonna remind everybody about it all the time and try to enshrine Christian beliefs in the law, even though that's unconstitutional" for my tastes. :P

(Personally, I'm still pissed at Obama for recording a message for "It Gets Better" for gay and lesbian youth suffering from bullying, telling them 'it gets better'... while simultaneously working to keep them as second-class citizens, not allowed the same rights as 'normal' citizens, discriminated against in thousands of little ways that straight people take for granted. Hypocrite.)
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Re: #685

Postby Kodi on Tue May 03, 2011 7:07 am

We're hearing rumors that Caesar Bin Laden may have been assassinated by an unknown party. It is currently not known how the assassin was able to evade security. Once again, Caesar dead. A shocking turn of events whose impact is anyone's guess at this point.

Y'know, I feel like the news brings us all closer together.

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Re: #685

Postby Mike on Tue May 03, 2011 7:22 am

Birther's are idiots. I think I could rant on it for months if I really wanted to...

As soon as I heard they wanted to check his school records to make sure his admission into Harvard was legit, I just laughed... and wanted to punch some motherfuckers.

The last few years have been the first time I've really felt justified in saying that people's opinions are just... wrong.

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Re: #685

Postby Jayleia on Tue May 03, 2011 2:10 pm

MadCat wrote:I'd be curious to know what these 'ties to the Islamic world' are in Obama's case. Not because I'm an Obama fan; I'm really not. But I'm genuinely curious; I hadn't heard anything 'Islamic' about him besides his middle name. If anything, he's far too "I'm a Christian and gonna remind everybody about it all the time and try to enshrine Christian beliefs in the law, even though that's unconstitutional" for my tastes. :P

(Personally, I'm still pissed at Obama for recording a message for "It Gets Better" for gay and lesbian youth suffering from bullying, telling them 'it gets better'... while simultaneously working to keep them as second-class citizens, not allowed the same rights as 'normal' citizens, discriminated against in thousands of little ways that straight people take for granted. Hypocrite.)


Obama did attend school in Indonesia from age 6-10. Which, if you listen to certain people, is where he was trained to be a super-marxo-islamic secret agent that would become LEADER OF THE FREE WORLD! Of course, these people also think that he's actually an alien lizard-person.

And yes, I'm annoyed about many of the things he's done, especially that. Yet we've had some victories that likely would have been impossible with a more conservative party (and if they'd put two RELIABLY conservative votes on the Supreme Court, that could have bollocksed progress for a generation). They've started working on removing DADT, not defending DOMA and this too http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9eFk0kA_5_U&feature=feedu.

He's FAR from perfect, but I'd say he's doing relatively well given the constraints of the system we're in.
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Re: #685

Postby Panda S. H. on Wed May 04, 2011 2:16 am

Madcat: Summarily, his ties to the Islamic world travel as far as the fact that his biological father is Muslim and the country he grew up in as a child has a significant Muslim population (granted there are separate "schools" of Islam in the Indies and in the Middle East.

I've no qualms about hating on him for legitimate, "he explicitly handled this situation wrong" reasons. Illegitimate, "he has no control over what the previous president started or what congress does" reasons are bs and these people should be beaten with Teddy's stick.
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Re: #685

Postby fireraven on Wed May 04, 2011 5:53 pm

Jayleia wrote:
MadCat wrote:They've started working on removing DADT, not defending DOMA


In my opinion that is one of the greatest things to have happened in American History. The defense of marriage act is a law based upon the principals of religious interpretation and has no place in our legal system. Don't as don't tell, on the other hand, would have some legitimacy if the majority of US soldiers did't want homosexuals fighting along side them. However, fact is from all the polls and military personnel I have spoken to, it should be noted I live in a military town in a military family and have large military ties, have said that they would happy to have them fighting along side them and would prefer them to a Muslim, Wiccan, Pagan, Buddhist, or anything that isn't Christian.

That's just my two sense though and I despise the last sentence in the previous paragraph for being true. =/
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Re: #685

Postby trebuchet on Thu May 05, 2011 10:57 am

@Panda: as far as I know there were only two American Presidents to have been impeached - Andrew Johnson and Bill Clinton. Somebody correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe both were impeached by the House of Representatives and acquitted by the Senate.

@Kodi: I take it you've been playing New Vegas recently. Caught me totally off-guard with that one. :D
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Re: #685

Postby Kodi on Thu May 05, 2011 1:15 pm

Yup :)

My inability to take federal politics the least bit seriously prevents me from contributing meaningfully to these heavy discussions, so instead I try to lighten the mood with obscure video game and pop culture references. ^_^

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Re: #685

Postby bethzania on Tue May 10, 2011 6:34 pm

fireraven wrote:Don't as don't tell, on the other hand, would have some legitimacy if the majority of US soldiers did't want homosexuals fighting along side them.

Out of curiosity, why?
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